Imagine This
January 23, 2001 05:19 PM
Imagine a virtual world populated with entites evolved through a trillion computer cycles across a distrubite super computer made up of hundereds of machines. A virtual world filled with evolved funa and flora, where magic exist. Where the unknown facing you, if you dare venture from the towns and roads, have never been seen nor even imagined by human eyes before. The princpiples are simple, the technology known, and the goal is ambitious. What i propose is creating another world, as deep and complex as the real world. So what are your thoughts?
-ddn
122
January 23, 2001 05:57 PM
It''s like taking SETI at home to a whole new level. If you can''t find it, make your own. 
I like the idea, but I think it would kill national productivity. You wouldn''t necessarily have to make it a game, I would be willing to watch a massive distributed simulation take place without being directly involved, and it would be more interesting to be able to see everything, not being limited to a single entity''s perception.
I like the idea, but I think it would kill national productivity. You wouldn''t necessarily have to make it a game, I would be willing to watch a massive distributed simulation take place without being directly involved, and it would be more interesting to be able to see everything, not being limited to a single entity''s perception.
634
January 24, 2001 01:18 AM
Some reason reminds me of a half-obscure movie "The Thirteenth Floor".
-Ryan "Run_The_Shadows"
-Run_The_Shadows@excite.com
"Doubt Everything. Find your own light." -Dying words of Gautama
-Ryan "Run_The_Shadows"
-Run_The_Shadows@excite.com
"Doubt Everything. Find your own light." -Dying words of Gautama
122
January 24, 2001 03:11 AM
I think the idea of a true virtual world is a great one.
Would the creatures in the world be truely alive? Imagine the chaos it could cause in the religious establishment...
Unfortunately, I think even if the component technologies exist, actual implementation is still a long way away.
Would the creatures in the world be truely alive? Imagine the chaos it could cause in the religious establishment...
Unfortunately, I think even if the component technologies exist, actual implementation is still a long way away.
January 24, 2001 03:20 AM
My thoughts:
get real, you know this is impossible.
Researchers haven''t even figured out yet how to harness computing power to improve artificial intelligence. No-one knows how to use a supercomputer to make a "smart" AI.
You just assume that by throwing enough power at it the problem will solve itself. That''s incredibly naive. How can you solve a problem if you can''t even define it yet?
I''m very tempted to just shut this thread down, because it''s entirely pointless. I see no useful discussion being generated here, but I''ll give it a sporting chance and leave it open for a little while.
People might not remember what you said, or what you did, but they will always remember how you made them feel.
Mad Keith the V.
get real, you know this is impossible.
Researchers haven''t even figured out yet how to harness computing power to improve artificial intelligence. No-one knows how to use a supercomputer to make a "smart" AI.
You just assume that by throwing enough power at it the problem will solve itself. That''s incredibly naive. How can you solve a problem if you can''t even define it yet?
I''m very tempted to just shut this thread down, because it''s entirely pointless. I see no useful discussion being generated here, but I''ll give it a sporting chance and leave it open for a little while.
People might not remember what you said, or what you did, but they will always remember how you made them feel.
Mad Keith the V.
It's only funny 'till someone gets hurt.And then it's just hilarious.Unless it's you.
1,394
January 24, 2001 04:14 AM
Thanks for keeping it open, MKV, although I do aggree that the idea is imposible, or at least for now...
My thoughts are that you could probably do this up to the "realy-dumb-animal" level realisticly. However, if you were to develop some kind of advanced AI that wasn''t the way a human mind works (which we don''t yet know exactly) but somthing that could make basic decisions and stuff.
Just think, you could simulate alot of useful things with that, for example, you could simulate to see what would happen if, for example, there was a form of death (meatorite, nuclear winter, etc) and find out how your virtual dudes handle it.
ANDREW RUSSELL STUDIOS
My thoughts are that you could probably do this up to the "realy-dumb-animal" level realisticly. However, if you were to develop some kind of advanced AI that wasn''t the way a human mind works (which we don''t yet know exactly) but somthing that could make basic decisions and stuff.
Just think, you could simulate alot of useful things with that, for example, you could simulate to see what would happen if, for example, there was a form of death (meatorite, nuclear winter, etc) and find out how your virtual dudes handle it.
ANDREW RUSSELL STUDIOS
January 24, 2001 11:18 AM
I dont think i said we're going to create sentient AI creatures which can philospohize. I proposed creating evolved virtual creatures which live within a virtual world, which then we can interact with through an avatar. Terra ^ 5 power,
[edited by MKV - Read the FAQ NOW!, there is NO public disagreeing with the moderator. If you have a problem, send me an email. I've been very tough on this before, and I will be again.]
Research into evolutionary systems, genetic programming, and artifical life are sufficently advance to create the creatures game (uses genetic algorithims for matting/propogation, artifical life simulation for the creatues bodies and brains, neural nets to allow them to learn, etc..), Terra (a binary ecosystem, where evolution does occur), and there are literally hundered of other artifical life simulations/examples.
It's a grand experiement/game, best left to the dreamers and doers. I know i have the dream and the means. I only asked you to imagine the possiblities.
-ddn
Edited by - MadKeithV on January 25, 2001 2:42:07 AM
[edited by MKV - Read the FAQ NOW!, there is NO public disagreeing with the moderator. If you have a problem, send me an email. I've been very tough on this before, and I will be again.]
Research into evolutionary systems, genetic programming, and artifical life are sufficently advance to create the creatures game (uses genetic algorithims for matting/propogation, artifical life simulation for the creatues bodies and brains, neural nets to allow them to learn, etc..), Terra (a binary ecosystem, where evolution does occur), and there are literally hundered of other artifical life simulations/examples.
It's a grand experiement/game, best left to the dreamers and doers. I know i have the dream and the means. I only asked you to imagine the possiblities.
-ddn
Edited by - MadKeithV on January 25, 2001 2:42:07 AM
January 24, 2001 11:42 AM
if this really does get developed, i think this is where the matrix comes in 
January 24, 2001 11:59 PM
An interesting idea.
Do we already have part of the concept in gaming already? Think of all those Unreal and Quake servers running out there. Now what if your avatar were actually part of the flora and fauna?
Imagine something like the old programmable agents in the game Core Wars. It would be a cross between a simulation / virtual pet environment and a game with real objectives. You''d want to evolve your creature in the various server environments. The environments and creatures would constantly be shifting as players created new challenges and solutions.
You could make this a screensaver much like Seti did. Or, if it were popular enough, people would dedicate servers.
I''d be curious to know, though, if the problem of trying to simulate a world could benefit from this massive parallel processing. Seti@Home''s model was to do data processing on many different machines and send back digested chunks to be amalgamated. I''m not sure this would work for a virtual environment as the data wouldn''t be very reliable, and it''s needed quickly if it''s going to be a game.
--------------------
Just waiting for the mothership...
Do we already have part of the concept in gaming already? Think of all those Unreal and Quake servers running out there. Now what if your avatar were actually part of the flora and fauna?
Imagine something like the old programmable agents in the game Core Wars. It would be a cross between a simulation / virtual pet environment and a game with real objectives. You''d want to evolve your creature in the various server environments. The environments and creatures would constantly be shifting as players created new challenges and solutions.
You could make this a screensaver much like Seti did. Or, if it were popular enough, people would dedicate servers.
I''d be curious to know, though, if the problem of trying to simulate a world could benefit from this massive parallel processing. Seti@Home''s model was to do data processing on many different machines and send back digested chunks to be amalgamated. I''m not sure this would work for a virtual environment as the data wouldn''t be very reliable, and it''s needed quickly if it''s going to be a game.
--------------------
Just waiting for the mothership...
--------------------Just waiting for the mothership...
January 27, 2001 12:10 PM
Yes, those are astute observerations. A convergence of technology is opening up the possibilites. Luckly the simulation can indeed be modeled like seti. Each server simulates/evolves organzisms within its domain, and exchanges genes/organisms with other server based upon their virutal proximity and geography. I feel the servers themselves are like an electronic organism, growing and dying over the network, competing for users/resources (literally as we can model the influx of users as virtual raw material which can be a nessecary nutrient in the ecosystem, when they die ofcourse 8^) ) etc..
Well, I''ll think more about it and post a tenative article with more fleshed out ideas.
-ddn
Well, I''ll think more about it and post a tenative article with more fleshed out ideas.
-ddn
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